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| Forums > Round Tables > General Discussion > Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... | ||
| Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... | Reply | |
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All, There have been some discussions within TopCoder recently about allowing anyone to compete in Round 2 whether or not they submitted in Round 1. Currently in our tournament-style contests, we have only allowed members who submit in Round 1 to compete in Round 2 for the final prizes. If this is changed, only the members who submit in Round 1 are still eligible for client feedback and the round 1 incentive prizes, but anyone would be able to register and compete after Round 2 begins. Good points have been made on both sides of the discussion so now we want to put it out to you, the community. - What do you think? - Would you still compete in Round 1 if you could start a tournament in Round 2? - Does this give any advantage or disadvantage to the members starting in Round 2 over those who competed in Round 1 (client feedback, forum questions, etc.)? - Do you see any benefits and/or drawbacks in competing in both Round 1 and 2? What about for competing only in Round 2? We want all of you to add to this conversation. Tell us your thoughts, suggestions and feedback. All of us on the Studio team will be a part of this discussion as well. Thanks a lot. |
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| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by spectorbrain ) | Reply | |
| If it is changed to allow members to compete in only round 2, perhaps round 1 feedback could be kept private, with maybe some general comments posted on the forum at the beginning of round 2. And where possible, feedback should provided for all those who made the effort to submit for round 1 (not only intermediate prize winners). Obviously this depends on whether there is not a very large number of submissions. Perhaps only those registered for round 1 can view the contest forum for that contest. Round 2 is usually posted as a new contest anyway with a new forum. | |
| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by spectorbrain ) | Reply | |
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I'm presuming as this is for Tournament style ones, the submissions and feedback are currently shown after R1. I think it's unfair for those who submit to R1 to have other people to come in, swoop benefits of the feedback and potentially win it. Plus, if nobody was required to enter R1, everybody would wait until feedback was given and potentially no-one will even enter R1. I try to get as much feedback as possible from the client, because you may be answering the brief, but their direction may alter a little bit once seeing the entries. Plus, feedback is far more effective when it is directed at your individual design. Sidenote: Sorry I've been so quiet lately, since getting back from Vegas - it's all been a bit busy and crazy and I haven't really had any time to be on here. |
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| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by djnapier ) | Reply | |
| Agree with you djnapier :) It's not easy to beat (time management) R1, and becomes not fair for those who submit in R1, while another people "wait and see and remix all R1 feedback" in R2. | |
| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by spectorbrain ) | Reply | |
| Great comments - everyone! As spectorbrain mentioned, we are holding discussions about this and we are very interested in your feedback. | |
| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by spectorbrain ) | Reply | |
| http://studio.topcoder.co.....&mc=2#16980 | |
| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by spectorbrain ) | Reply | |
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- What do you think? it will be great. but, like ali said from another thread, it will be more great if only contestant that compete in R1 can see the feedback from client in some private room/thread, i mean, "all" contestant that compete R1 can see all client feedback, and not just the R1 winner. and also, it will be greatest if contestant that compete R1 who can access question forum while contestant who start compete from R2 cannot. - Would you still compete in Round 1 if you could start a tournament in Round 2? yes. but it depend's on what "special" treatment that will be award to R1 competitor. same like the first answer, client feedback in private room and access to question forum. - Does this give any advantage or disadvantage to the members starting in Round 2 over those who competed in Round 1 (client feedback, questions forum, etc.)? i think it will give disadvantages for members who start from R2, coz client feedback and question forum very important. i think that's my opinion. :) |
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| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by spectorbrain ) | Reply | |
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Everyone, This is a very old thread but I thought I would bring up this subject again. How does the community still feel about Round 2 eligibility being tied to submitting in Round 1? Note: for any new Studio members we originally started Milestones/Rounds as a 2 contest Tournament - since this thread the concept as been integrated into what you know see as a standard two round contest. I've seen many requests to join contests during Round 2 lately and I've also had clients/project managers inquire why their contest is now restricted after Round 1. Note: My original intention with Milestones/tournaments was to allow competitors and clients the opportunity to have a mini design review - this would allow the client to focus on their message (are they explaining everything correctly) and allow competitors an opportunity to submit their concepts/designs before wasting time going in the wrong direction. I'm not sure if Milestones are being used this way (its how I approach them). Please share your thoughts - Should a competitor be allowed to join at anytime - Is there an advantage of joining after the Milestone? - Is it unfair to the competitors who submitted in R1 to allow anyone to join in R2? - Does the Milestone feedback help? - Any other suggestions? Thank you |
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| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by adroc ) | Reply | |
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In my opinion current way is optimal and don't need to be changed. If competitor are going to make good quality submission, then first round is very helpful - give a opportunity to adjust submission to fit exactly in client's point of view, also to avoid wrong direction. - Should a competitor be allowed to join at anytime No, only in 1 round. - Is there an advantage of joining after the Milestone? More people will compete, but quality of submission will be lower => need more work to review - Is it unfair to the competitors who submitted in R1 to allow anyone to join in R2? It may cause a negative tendency to compete only in R2 and don't care about client feedback - Does the Milestone feedback help? Yes, it help a lot, especially in Idea Generation contests. - Any other suggestions? I propose to add 'initial review' stage - sometimes my submission fail of a small mistake, eg. forgot to list a one non-standard font, and all work go to waste. I see it like a additional screening in 2h before end of contest - it should be optional and give chance to fix all small errors. |
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| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by bdfhjk ) | Reply | |
| I prefer the current system :) Those who submit during R1 phase should only be allowed to submit in R2 phase :) | |
| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by diskoverx ) | Reply | |
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I agree with bdfhjk and diskoverx, since this current system is an improvement from the old. My reason is about the fair play since this is a contest community. If a client didn't feel comfortable with TopCoder system, they can hire a professional/freelance designer :-) And also with bdfhjk'c comment for Other Suggestion: It will be good when a member's submission contain a violation that will make his/her submission failed screening, then he/she got an "alert" to their email address, informing what violation belong their submission. It can given about 1 or 2 hour before the deadline. Of course not all competitor will be alerted, only them who submit a lot of time before deadline. Thank you. |
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| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by adroc ) | Reply | |
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I think the 2 round process is still the best solution for certain projects. As much as it's 'unfair' for those who compete from the start, if people joined in R2 they are at a disadvantage because they haven't have the chance for direct feedback from the client (milestone). As designers, we should allow enough time for the two round process to make the best submission possible and if we can't give our best, then it's not helping the client. Things like logo competitions however (if the brief doesn't change between rounds) could be open for entrants in R2. It needs to be a case by case situation, and in that case, a blanket enforcing on R1 participation is probably the best. |
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| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by adroc ) | Reply | |
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I think the 2 round process is still the best solution for certain projects. As much as it's 'unfair' for those who compete from the start, if people joined in R2 they are at a disadvantage because they haven't have the chance for direct feedback from the client (milestone). As designers, we should allow enough time for the two round process to make the best submission possible and if we can't give our best, then it's not helping the client. Things like logo competitions however (if the brief doesn't change between rounds) could be open for entrants in R2. It needs to be a case by case situation, and in that case, a blanket enforcing on R1 participation is probably the best. |
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| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by djnapier ) | Reply | |
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Yes I also agree that current way is optimal and don't need to be changed :) And it's a good thought Additional screening in 2h before end of contest - it should be optional and give chance to fix all small errors." Any other suggestions? yes, After R2 If client haven't satisfy their solutions then I think instead of cancel contest could be open for entrants in R3 and in that time again all competitor can be allowed to join (but R3 confirmation given to the competitor within 48 or 72 hours). One think we don't deny that Clients are always looking ultimate Final solutions instead of contest :) |
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| Re: Your thoughts on Studio Tournaments and when you can compete... (response to post by ngraphics ) | Reply | |
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Thanks everyone for the feedback! @ngraphics - I'm intrigued by this third round or continuation - we would need to make sure its not abused - can only be used in specific situations. - I want to make sure we keep this as a contest (not get into a bunch of design "rounds") - Yes - Clients are more interested in a "final solution" instead of the method @everyone Yes - we do need an initial round of screening or a process to catch the mini mistakes - this doesn't help anyone (you the competitors & the client) - We now have community members who are screeners so this might be possible. - Any additional process thoughts on this? |
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